Wednesday, November 05, 2003
WAGNER TO PHILLY DEAL
The first big move of winter baseball.
This is a good deal for Houston - Billy Wagner for Brandon Duckworth and two pitching prospects. Yes, an all-star closer for a disappointing pitching prospect and two irrelevant minor league pitchers is a good deal for the Astros. "Cash is king" and the Astros saved roughly $11 million ($8 owed to Wagner in 2004 and a $3 buyout). The Astros should also not loose much production from their pen. Dotel, Lidge and company should be more than adequate. On top of it all, the timing of the deal was perrrrrrrrfect. It should allow the Astros to make a real offer to Andy Pettitte.
On the flip side, Philly gets the security of knowing that they filled their greatest perceived need - a closer - early in the off-season. It was very costly move and unnecessary based on the demand and supply for "proven closers." Assuming only contending teams need a "proven closer," the clubs possibly in the market along with Philly would have been the Twins, other Sox, A's, Mariners, Miami, Cubbies, Padres and Giants. Only Seattle could realistically make a similar deal for Wagner. The other teams could not afford $11 million to one player not even considering he is a closer that will pitch less than 90 innings (perhaps, the Cubs but the Astros would not trade with a division rival). If Seattle was going to make a play for Wagner, cost cutting moves would need to be taken before or included in a deal. Thus, there was no need for Philly to move quickly on Wagner. Houston only had Philly to dance with but Wade had the entire free agent market.
The deal gets even more perplexing as Jason Starks gets into the details of the negotiations for espn.com.
The Phillies were one of those teams. And once they got that call, it was the Phillies -- not the Astros -- who pushed the envelope.
Over the next week, Wade estimates, he and Hunsicker swapped "eight or nine phone calls." Then, a week and a half ago, Wade flew to Houston for a memorial service -- but used the occasion to meet with Hunsicker and Astros president Tal Smith in person, "just to show how serious our interest was."
"We met for about an hour," Wade said. "But it was actually all night, because I stayed overnight at Tal Smith's house. Then we met the next morning in Tal's library -- which, by the way, is not located on Tal's Hill."
When he left that meeting, however, Wade said he was convinced this deal "wasn't going to happen, because of the names involved. I got a little stubborn on a couple of names."
But once he became convinced that balking on Buchholz would be a deal-breaker, Wade relented.
Starks goes on to report that...
Clearing money was enough of a priority for the Astros that they were willing to move this fast. But it was the Phillies who were determined to get their biggest offseason objective cleared off the board before the free-agent negotiating period had even begun.
"The Astros were very respectful and responsive, from the standpoint of me saying, I need to know now," Wade said. "I said, 'We can't go forward, left or right, with the closer or anything else, until we know if we're taking on an $8-million closer or, potentially, a $17-million closer. It's sort of a big deal.' Fortunately, they were willing to move at the same pace."
The Tal Smith had Ed Wade wrapped around his finger. He still doesn't get it. Of course, they were willing to move at the same FAST pace. The Astros want to free up cash to make a play for Andy. Houston is probably upset at themselves for not asking for better prospects.
Philly fans be afraid, be very afraid and hope the new stadium yields a budget similar to the other clubs that border Jersey. If not, it is going to be difficult to sure up the questions at second, third, center, middle relief and the back of the rotation.
For more of a pure on the field baseball analysis of the deal check out Ben and Aaron.
The first big move of winter baseball.
This is a good deal for Houston - Billy Wagner for Brandon Duckworth and two pitching prospects. Yes, an all-star closer for a disappointing pitching prospect and two irrelevant minor league pitchers is a good deal for the Astros. "Cash is king" and the Astros saved roughly $11 million ($8 owed to Wagner in 2004 and a $3 buyout). The Astros should also not loose much production from their pen. Dotel, Lidge and company should be more than adequate. On top of it all, the timing of the deal was perrrrrrrrfect. It should allow the Astros to make a real offer to Andy Pettitte.
On the flip side, Philly gets the security of knowing that they filled their greatest perceived need - a closer - early in the off-season. It was very costly move and unnecessary based on the demand and supply for "proven closers." Assuming only contending teams need a "proven closer," the clubs possibly in the market along with Philly would have been the Twins, other Sox, A's, Mariners, Miami, Cubbies, Padres and Giants. Only Seattle could realistically make a similar deal for Wagner. The other teams could not afford $11 million to one player not even considering he is a closer that will pitch less than 90 innings (perhaps, the Cubs but the Astros would not trade with a division rival). If Seattle was going to make a play for Wagner, cost cutting moves would need to be taken before or included in a deal. Thus, there was no need for Philly to move quickly on Wagner. Houston only had Philly to dance with but Wade had the entire free agent market.
The deal gets even more perplexing as Jason Starks gets into the details of the negotiations for espn.com.
The Phillies were one of those teams. And once they got that call, it was the Phillies -- not the Astros -- who pushed the envelope.
Over the next week, Wade estimates, he and Hunsicker swapped "eight or nine phone calls." Then, a week and a half ago, Wade flew to Houston for a memorial service -- but used the occasion to meet with Hunsicker and Astros president Tal Smith in person, "just to show how serious our interest was."
"We met for about an hour," Wade said. "But it was actually all night, because I stayed overnight at Tal Smith's house. Then we met the next morning in Tal's library -- which, by the way, is not located on Tal's Hill."
When he left that meeting, however, Wade said he was convinced this deal "wasn't going to happen, because of the names involved. I got a little stubborn on a couple of names."
But once he became convinced that balking on Buchholz would be a deal-breaker, Wade relented.
Starks goes on to report that...
Clearing money was enough of a priority for the Astros that they were willing to move this fast. But it was the Phillies who were determined to get their biggest offseason objective cleared off the board before the free-agent negotiating period had even begun.
"The Astros were very respectful and responsive, from the standpoint of me saying, I need to know now," Wade said. "I said, 'We can't go forward, left or right, with the closer or anything else, until we know if we're taking on an $8-million closer or, potentially, a $17-million closer. It's sort of a big deal.' Fortunately, they were willing to move at the same pace."
The Tal Smith had Ed Wade wrapped around his finger. He still doesn't get it. Of course, they were willing to move at the same FAST pace. The Astros want to free up cash to make a play for Andy. Houston is probably upset at themselves for not asking for better prospects.
Philly fans be afraid, be very afraid and hope the new stadium yields a budget similar to the other clubs that border Jersey. If not, it is going to be difficult to sure up the questions at second, third, center, middle relief and the back of the rotation.
For more of a pure on the field baseball analysis of the deal check out Ben and Aaron.